Perry Rosemond

Transcription

[blank] Bob Hepburn: My role here tonight as Tina mentioned is to introduce the panelists. We're gonna talk about the future of the CBC. And this event is extremely timely, given the budget cuts that the CBC has just suffered or is suffering from the Harper government, and you've heard about the cancelling of several CBC programs. These cuts have raised yet again, questions about the CBC role: What kind of public broadcaster do we want? How much you're willing to pay for it? Now, the Toronto Star has long considered CBC a vital Canadian institution. CBC and Toronto Star always get tagged with being those liberal media organizations, and so at this moment of great uncertainty for the CBC, the Star has launched, what we're dubbing "The Network." This is a national discussion about the CBC and public broadcasting, and this network features debates and columns from media thinkers and personalities and consumers. Consumers, those people like you who shape what the CBC is, and who simply watch, read, listen to, and pay for it. So I invite you to take a look at it online, on our main website, thestar.com. BH: So now let me introduce our panel: Linden MacIntyre, who's been associated with the CBC since 1976. Since 1990, he has been co-host with "The Fifth of State," CBC TV's award-winning investigative program, and during his career, Linden has won nine Gemini Awards. At least I think it's nine at the last count, including three Gordon Sinclair awards for the Best Overall Broadcast Journalist. His novel, "The Bishop's Man," won the 2009 Giller Prize and his newest novel, "Why Men Lie," or his newest book, "Why Men Lie," is receiving universal acclaim. BH: Suanne Kelman is the Associate Chair of the School of Journalism at Ryerson University, and prior to joining Ryerson, Suanne worked for many years in both radio and television at the CBC, including the radio show, "Sunday Morning," as well as "The Journal." She's also written extensively for newspapers and magazines in Toronto and across the country. Richard Stursberg, on my far end here, is the former Head of CBC's English Language Services, which includes television, radio and online. His arrival at CBC in 2004 from a background in television, film and entertainment and government, upset many in Mother Corp. His six-year push to popularize its programming, exasperated staffers, outside supporters, occasionally the Toronto Star, and his political masters. His new book, "The Tower of Babel," is a look-back at Richard's tumultuous time at the CBC. But importantly, the book also offers some prescriptions which he believes will help restore the public broadcaster to health. BH: Perry Rosemond, who's been honoured for his work with an Order of Canada, is a well-known television writer, producer, and director. He created the CBC series, "King of Kensington," and was its producer in the first year. And Perry was also producer, director and writer of the "Royal Canadian Air Farce." BH: And our moderator in the middle, tonight, is Martin Knelman, who's been an entertainment columnist at The Star since the year 2000. And so I'll turn it over now to Martin. Thank you very much for coming. [applause] Martin Knelman: Okay. Welcome, everybody. We're going to start with some brief introductory statements by each of the four panelists, then we're gonna go to some questions that I'm going to address to them, and then we're gonna take it to the floor for Q&A. So I'm gonna ask Linden to start with the... Each of the panelists I'm gonna ask to explain what should be the most important objective in the future of the CBC, how can that be achieved, and what is the chief obstacle to achieving it. Okay, Linden? Linden MacIntyre: Okay. I can't promise to follow the formulation that you offered, but I do wanna start off by saying that I'm not here speaking for the CBC, I'm not authorized to speak for the CBC. There are people in higher... Higher up the food chain who probably could do a better job of it. I am here as a tax payer, which I am, and I have some knowledge of the CBC, and I have a personal commitment to the principles of public service broadcasting. For 75 years, the CBC -- and I think Perry is a living example of this era -- the CBC was a cornerstone of Canadian culture. During the '40s and the '50s and the '60s, most of the original music and drama produced in Canada came either from or through the CBC. In the '70s and in the '80s, CBC became a centre for world-class innovation in journalism and information programming on radio and television. The problem is that for the past 25 years, the CBC has struggled to sustain its public service cultural mandate, in spite of political hostility expressed in crippling budget cuts and more recently, open challenges to the legitimacy of the CBC by influential conservative politicians. LM: For context, I mean, we just recently had another budget cut, and people are saying, "Why, why are the CBC whining?" like these are tough times, everybody has to swallow their spoonful of medicine. Well, you have to look at it in historical context, which starts 25 or more years ago when the Mulroney government started cutting at the CBC followed up by, the Liberals were always considered to be our friends. [chuckle] Friends like this, as the late Larry Zolf used to say, "with friends like this, we don't need enemas." [laughter] LM: Jean Chrétien and Paul Martin in the middle of the 90's, cut one-third of the CBC budget, as part of an overall attempt to get the unsustainable deficit under control. But in the years immediately after that round of cuts, overall cultural spending, excluding the CBC, grew, as they began to restore. The economy grew and they began to put public money back into the places they took it away from. And general cultural spending grew by, I understand, close to 40%. LM: Curiously, the CBC funding continued to shrink down through the years. Four years ago, and Richard can talk about this if he wants to, the CBC suffered a major revenue shortfall because of economic circumstances, resulted in more program grief. So, you have to keep that in mind when you're thinking about the fact that just recently the CBC was dealt another 10% reduction in its budgetary allocation. Today, now here's an example of what happens. LM: Today the CBC, we found out that the CBC has declared redundant, the position of probably the best media lawyer in Canada. A man who has kept us afloat, legally speaking, for 30 years, today his position is redundant. See the problem with all these cuts is that it puts management in a very difficult position, a position where they make hard choices. Which of the children get the shoes? Now, Richard, in his time, would have, and did, decide that the shoes should go to the cute kids, [laughter] who could go out and earn money busking, [laughter] and the smart kids could go to school in bare feet [laughter] if in fact they had the strength. S?: They didn't need any help. They were smart. [laughter] LM: If they had the strength to get out of the house without breakfast or lunch and get to the school in the first place. The problem with this and I'm sure you're gonna hear more of it from my friend and former colleague on the left, that in this climate of political and mercenary hostility to public broadcasting, it is in my opinion irresponsible and dangerous to be seen to be giving too much of the favouritism to the cute kids, to be seen to mimic the entertainment that's already available as mostly American escapism with zero value as enlightenment, which happens to be one of the core values of the CBC mandate. A huge majority of Canadians, 83% according to one recent survey, still regard the CBC as a crucial safeguard for Canadian identity and culture. And they deserve, and I believe a lot of them are here tonight, I mean, they deserve, what I believe parliament instructed us to deliver, entertainment, but entertainment that's informative and enlightening, an alternative to the sentimental escapism that defines so much of the commercial schedule. But they also, above all, and this probably gets to your instruction, they deserve information that offers an engaging and intelligent alternative to the trivia and propaganda that dominates so much of the broadcast media today. MK: Thank you. [applause] MK: Okay. Okay, Richard, take it away. Richard Stursberg: Well, I of course agree with everything that Linden says. I'm gonna make one general point, which is that... And then I'm gonna tell you a story. Whatever it is that is the role of the CBC, for sure, it should not duplicate what the private broadcasters are prepared to do. It should do those things that they cannot or they will not do. RS: About four or five years ago, if you don't mind a little plug for the book, this could be a very nice frontend at the back [chuckle] The very, very first story in the book recounts, I was invited, there's a thing called the Académie du Cinéma et de la Telévision Canadienne, which is the equivalent, it's sort of the... It gives prizes for television and movies, and it's a sort of industry group in Quebec. And so they had invited me to come down to Montreal to give a talk on the strategy for English services at the CBC. So I thought to myself, "Alright, the right way to begin a talk on strategy is to explain the problem." So I projected onto the wall a list of the top 30 shows in English Canada, and beside each one of them, I put a little flag to mark its country of origin. All the flags were American. RS: The reaction from the French producers in Montreal was fascinating. You could hear them rumbling in the room. "No! C'est pas possible!" [chuckle] Strong men gasped, beautiful women started to fan themselves. One rather elderly but extremely distinguished writer passed out. And of course, they were perfectly right. If I had done the same thing with respect to the top shows in French in Canada, they would have all had little Canadian flags beside. Now then, the fascinating thing is that Canada is the only country in the industrialized world that overwhelmingly prefers other people's television shows. If you go to the United States, you go to Italy, you go to Germany, you go anywhere you like, and the shows that dominate are the local shows. RS: But what is television actually about? Because you know, you've gotta remember that television is overwhelmingly the most important medium, cultural medium, that we have. On average, on average, I hear little groans coming from the audience, little groans... On average, Canadians watch television 26 hours a week. Their consumption of television completely dwarfs their consumption of every other medium. And what do they actually watch on television? What do they watch is they watch entertainment shows. That's what they watch. The schedules in deep prime time of all the major broadcasters, whether public or private, anywhere in the industrialized world are dominated by entertainment shows, because that fundamentally is what television is about. RS: Now, you say to yourself then, "Okay, what is it that we should be doing at the CBC?" First of all, if we're gonna solve the problem where the top 30 shows uniquely in English Canada among all the sophisticated countries in the world are foreign, and if you know that those shows are indeed all about entertainment, then what it means is we should focus on making Canadian entertainment shows. We should focus on making Canadian dramas, on Canadian situation comedies, on Canadian reality shows. And the truth of the matter is the only organization in the country that is in a position to be able to deliver on that is the CBC. And the reason for it is, that Global and CTV and all the other big networks in Canada, in English Canada, the way they make their money is they go to Los Angeles and they buy American shows. That is their business. They buy American shows, they put 'em on, and they put 'em on when the American broadcasters put 'em on. So if I buy a show that CBS has and I'm CTV, I put it on at exactly the same time as CBS puts it on. And the reason I do that is because I can maximize my advertising revenues because I can do what's called simulcasting it. So the cable company will take my feed, the CTV's C feed, and it will impose it over the CBS feed of the same show. RS: The deep prime time, when people are actually watching television, from 8 o'clock in the evening to 11 o'clock at night, five nights a week, from Sunday to Thursday, which is when overwhelmingly the most people are watching television, is for the private networks completely dominated by US shows. And that's not new. It's been that way since the beginning of private television in Canada, and it will be that way forever. So, if we ask ourselves what is the greatest cultural challenge in English Canada? It's not newspapers; Canadians love Canadian newspapers. It's not news generally; Canadians overwhelmingly prefer Canadian news. They like Canadian books, they like Canadian music, they like Canadian sports teams, it doesn't matter how many Canadians play on the Philadelphia Flyers, they could care less. They want Canadian sports teams. The one great area where we have failed culturally is in terms of producing Canadian entertainment shows, and the only organization in the country that is in a position to be able to deliver on that is the CBC. MK: Okay. Thank you, Richard. [applause] MK: Perry, the view from North Winnipeg please. [laughter] Perry Rosemond: Thank you for inviting me, and Richard I have to tell you, your book is one of the most incisive and informative books I've ever read on this subject, just congratulations really. RS: Well, thank you. Thank you. PR: I don't know if we're getting a bargain with the CBC. If they won't show the books to Parliament, why would they show them to me, right? But Mr. Harper is willing to pay only this amount of money, and there are no counter offers at this point. I feel CBC now provides a service of providing Canadian program to Canadians. Beyond that, CBC in these times where licenses have plummeted, are now able to still protect the creative people in the industry. Because as license plummets, the only business is business. And then creative runs the danger of being pushed down the ladder. CBC to its credit, since the turn of the century, has kept creative writing as the driving force behind their shows, and they can be extremely proud of the shows that they have on the air today. I once spoke with an American executive and he said, "Perry, I wish that I could do programming that I could go home and watch, but I can't." [laughter] PR: He said, "I have to do programming for the people we fly over." To CBC's credit, all these years, they have realized that the people we fly over are smarter than us. And where we should go? This gets really scary now. Arts and creative programming. Are you with me? Up to now, we were doing the arts a disservice by putting it on television. Let's give it a new name, let's call it spectacular theatrical enterprises, that's what we should be doing. I remember watching a production of the opera, the Russian version of Eugene Onegin, I watched it with that guy over there, Gordie Penson, he was my roommate at 42 Bedford Road. Any awards today, Icon or it's been a dry day, what do you think? [chuckle] The day is young. PR: In any event, it was broadcast on a small screen with a minute speaker, and I have to confess, I didn't make it to the end of that broadcast. Nobody made it to the end of that broadcast. We were in fact doing the public a disservice. Now, we have giant screens with magnificent productions, The Metropolitan Opera Company, The Olivier National, our own recent brilliant production of Stratford's Twelfth Night on these screens, which will soon transport themselves on to our massive screens at home to join the Manitoba Theatre Centre production of the hit Broadway Musical "The Drowsy Chaperone". And providing this for free, will be the public broadcaster, thanks. [applause]